"Sex Unknown" option

Discussion in Feature Requests Forum started by Ginger, Oct 21, 2015
G
Ginger
With parents naming their children with all sorts of names, sometimes it's impossible to know if the child is a boy or girl. Therefore, would appreciate a third choice option besides the blue boxes for males and the pink boxes for girls.

Thanks!

L
Les
  website
Hi Ginger, why not

Select the PERSON and Use EVENTS and select CUSTOM and add what you wish to explain .

SEE SCREEN SHOT

You will see this is for GAY MARRIAGES, but just put I AM A GIRL or I AM A BOY, with the NAME that the parents have chosen.

This will now show underneath.

All the best

Les

L
Les
  website
Hi Ginger, why not Select the PERSON and Use EVENTS and select CUSTOM and add what you wish to explain . SEE SCREEN SHOT You will see this is for GAY MARRIAGES, but just put I AM A GIRL or I AM A more ...
BOY, with the NAME that the parents have chosen. This will now show underneath. All the best Le
See SCREEN SHOT

Regards

Les

G
Ginger
Hi Ginger, why not Select the PERSON and Use EVENTS and select CUSTOM and add what you wish to explain . SEE SCREEN SHOT You will see this is for GAY MARRIAGES, but just put I AM A GIRL or I AM A more ...
BOY, with the NAME that the parents have chosen. This will now show underneath. All the best Le
If I don't know the sex due to the spelling of the name, how can I know whether to select "girl" or "boy" so I can enter the name?

My genealogy software provides an "unknown" box along with "boy" or "girl" for such cases. Hope TribalPages can make this option available as well.

L
Les
  website
If I don't know the sex due to the spelling of the name, how can I know whether to select "girl" or "boy" so I can enter the name? My genealogy software provides an "unknown" more ...
box along with "boy" or "girl" for such cases. Hope TribalPages can make this option available as well
Hi Ginger, Family ties do not seem to be very close to you.

Surely when you see these unusual names, the Family have mentioned that they have had a Son or Daughter .

Otherwise when you get this information, why not show some interset and ask them.

My opinion is that these names are so few, that there is no point added a new box, otherwise there will be request for boxes for pets, as I know my dog "Pip" to my wife and Myself, is treated and would be missed as a Family member, and more so in some cases, as my other Dogs in the past have been.

As I have mentioned, there is plenty of ways to put under the name, ( by the Member ) an explanation.

By the time these Forum entries were entered it could have been done.

All the best

Les

PY
Pauline Young
Hi Ginger, Family ties do not seem to be very close to you. Surely when you see these unusual names, the Family have mentioned that they have had a Son or Daughter . Otherwise when you get this info more ...
rmation, why not show some interset and ask them. My opinion is that these names are so few, that there is no point added a new box, otherwise there will be request for boxes for pets, as I know my dog "Pip" to my wife and Myself, is treated and would be missed as a Family member, and more so in some cases, as my other Dogs in the past have been. As I have mentioned, there is plenty of ways to put under the name, ( by the Member ) an explanation. By the time these Forum entries were entered it could have been done. All the best Le
Hi Both

I've been following this thread, and can see what you're saying, Les, but, from my own experience, when going through parish registers, there is often an entry along the lines of 'a stillborn child of...',or, when a unbaptised child dies, simply 'a child of....'. There is absolutely no way of knowing these infants' names or sex. It is wrong to treat these babies as never having existed,so an option of 'unknown' at least allows them to be recorded accurately.

I know that in most respects the sex makes no difference, (reports etc.), but I just feel it would give more dignity than a just 'oh, put it down as a boy/girl, it won't matter'.

Just my personal thoughts.

All the best

Pauline

L
Les
  website
Hi Both I've been following this thread, and can see what you're saying, Les, but, from my own experience, when going through parish registers, there is often an entry along the lines of 'a more ...
stillborn child of...',or, when a unbaptised child dies, simply 'a child of....'. There is absolutely no way of knowing these infants' names or sex. It is wrong to treat these babies as never having existed,so an option of 'unknown' at least allows them to be recorded accurately. I know that in most respects the sex makes no difference, (reports etc.), but I just feel it would give more dignity than a just 'oh, put it down as a boy/girl, it won't matter'. Just my personal thoughts. All the best Paulin
Hi Pauline, yes I can see where you are coming from, but this was not the Query. You can still use the Events to explain, but pick any Gender, as you are still adding to the tree.

Yours is for a child not known but Ginger can easily find out from the Parents.

As I said just my opinion, and we can easily set our Tribal Page to suit ourselves, without having a program altered.

Regards

Les

L
Les
Hi Both I've been following this thread, and can see what you're saying, Les, but, from my own experience, when going through parish registers, there is often an entry along the lines of 'a more ...
stillborn child of...',or, when a unbaptised child dies, simply 'a child of....'. There is absolutely no way of knowing these infants' names or sex. It is wrong to treat these babies as never having existed,so an option of 'unknown' at least allows them to be recorded accurately. I know that in most respects the sex makes no difference, (reports etc.), but I just feel it would give more dignity than a just 'oh, put it down as a boy/girl, it won't matter'. Just my personal thoughts. All the best Paulin
Seeing a Request for an additional Box for UNKNOWN by “Ginger” and Pauline, they seem to want this as a Box alongside the Gender Blue and Pink boxes, and this would look out of place; also this would be very limited and hardly used...

They give no explanation how this would work, regarding the appearance of the Family Tree.

Surely as “Les” has said, the facility is already there, with the provision to add this to EVENTS or the Persons Notes, when they are selected in EDIT. This would then only be applicable to the Family Tree being updated, as opposed to the whole of TRIBAL PAGES program.

With the information that they both have, they have a 50% chance of being correct. In Pauline’s case this would not really matter as there would not be any ancestors, but at least she would be able to recognise them in her site albeit with no Gender Name.

As for”Ginger” He/She (As we do not know and have not been corrected) so assume that “Ginger” is a he. He will soon be corrected by relatives if he is incorrect, and just a small usage of Names in “GOOGLE” should help him...

When thinking of these requests, they should be subject to

Is it needed by all YES/ NO?

Is the facility or similar already there to do this YES/NO

Is it simple to do YES/NO?

Will it be constantly in use?

As other parts of the Program YES/ NO

Just my thoughts

Lisa

PY
Pauline Young
Seeing a Request for an additional Box for UNKNOWN by “Ginger” and Pauline, they seem to want this as a Box alongside the Gender Blue and Pink boxes, and this would look out of place; also this would more ...
be very limited and hardly used... They give no explanation how this would work, regarding the appearance of the Family Tree. Surely as “Les” has said, the facility is already there, with the provision to add this to EVENTS or the Persons Notes, when they are selected in EDIT. This would then only be applicable to the Family Tree being updated, as opposed to the whole of TRIBAL PAGES program. With the information that they both have, they have a 50% chance of being correct. In Pauline’s case this would not really matter as there would not be any ancestors, but at least she would be able to recognise them in her site albeit with no Gender Name. As for”Ginger” He/She (As we do not know and have not been corrected) so assume that “Ginger” is a he. He will soon be corrected by relatives if he is incorrect, and just a small usage of Names in “GOOGLE” should help him... When thinking of these requests, they should be subject to Is it needed by all YES/ NO? Is the facility or similar already there to do this YES/NO Is it simple to do YES/NO? Will it be constantly in use? As other parts of the Program YES/ NO Just my thoughts Lis
Lisa

It appears that, quite inadvertently, we have opened a hornet's nest. Let me answer a few of your comments.

Firstly, you say "With the information that they both have, they have a 50% chance of being correct. In Pauline’s case this would not really matter as there would not be any ancestors". Of course a still born or child who died in infancy had ancestors - how would they be there otherwise? What they do not have is descendants. What they also have is a great emotional relevance to surviving close family members. Obviously, we did not know relatives 500 years ago, but it is incumbent on us to record as accurately as possible what details we have. 50% right is also 50% wrong, not a margin for error that I would be happy to accept in this or any other circumstance.

I do accept that with living family members (and, to an extent, those that were alive during census periods), the correct gender can eventually be ascertained, probably when a person gains a partner (except same sex partners), but with a young child, this could take many years.

I also find your attitude extremely patronising in your series of questions, as

1. Do you use 100% of the facilities available on the program? I would be very surprised if you did, I believe that most programs run at approximately 75% patron usage.

2. The facility is NOT there to use, what is available is a workaround. This is NOT the same thing, whether or not it is easy to use.

3. The fact that you would have no use for a facility does not render it superfluous to the requirements of others. If you came forward with a suggestion on this forum, no doubt Les, who tries to help everyone, would come up with a viable workaround, but here is the difference between us, I would not condemn you for making the request, even if it was on no use to me, personally.

I consider this thread to be concluded and will not dignify with an answer any further posts you may make on this subject .

Pauline Young

L
Lisa
Lisa It appears that, quite inadvertently, we have opened a hornet's nest. Let me answer a few of your comments. Firstly, you say "With the information that they both have, they have a 50% more ...
chance of being correct. In Pauline’s case this would not really matter as there would not be any ancestors". Of course a still born or child who died in infancy had ancestors - how would they be there otherwise? What they do not have is descendants. What they also have is a great emotional relevance to surviving close family members. Obviously, we did not know relatives 500 years ago, but it is incumbent on us to record as accurately as possible what details we have. 50% right is also 50% wrong, not a margin for error that I would be happy to accept in this or any other circumstance. I do accept that with living family members (and, to an extent, those that were alive during census periods), the correct gender can eventually be ascertained, probably when a person gains a partner (except same sex partners), but with a young child, this could take many years. I also find your attitude extremely patronising in your series of questions, as 1. Do you use 100% of the facilities available on the program? I would be very surprised if you did, I believe that most programs run at approximately 75% patron usage. 2. The facility is NOT there to use, what is available is a workaround. This is NOT the same thing, whether or not it is easy to use. 3. The fact that you would have no use for a facility does not render it superfluous to the requirements of others. If you came forward with a suggestion on this forum, no doubt Les, who tries to help everyone, would come up with a viable workaround, but here is the difference between us, I would not condemn you for making the request, even if it was on no use to me, personally. I consider this thread to be concluded and will not dignify with an answer any further posts you may make on this subject . Pauline Youn
Pauline, I did not expect you to take umbrage and be so vociferous, over a simple entry of mine .Was it because i asked for your explanation of what it would look like and how it would work.

At the moment you must be entering Male or female for one of your unknown 50% correct or as you maintain 50% WRONG to keep a record of your UNKNOWNS.

As you are then in their EDIT you have to select a Christian name, which all you can do is enter NOT KNOWN or as you say UNKNOWN.

Now what is wrong with SIMPLY putting an explanation in their NOTES or to simplify use EVENTS, and Name one as you wish, to use any time this occurs, as my Dad Les has suggested.

This is not so much a workaround but already there, so no box of your request needed.

Just so simple, and would only affect your Tree ( Site)and not the whole of Tribal Pages

I see that you agree with me regarding Ginger's Name choices.

I did not mention anything about using the TP site at 100% only to check when requesting anything, will it be used at its maximum, as there would not be any point in putting it on the program, for such a limited use..

I did not wish to upset anyone on Tribal Pages,but you seem to have made your mind up, that another box is needed but to explain how to use it is a different matter..

Regards

Lisa

L
Lisa
Seeing a Request for an additional Box for UNKNOWN by “Ginger” and Pauline, they seem to want this as a Box alongside the Gender Blue and Pink boxes, and this would look out of place; also this would more ...
be very limited and hardly used... They give no explanation how this would work, regarding the appearance of the Family Tree. Surely as “Les” has said, the facility is already there, with the provision to add this to EVENTS or the Persons Notes, when they are selected in EDIT. This would then only be applicable to the Family Tree being updated, as opposed to the whole of TRIBAL PAGES program. With the information that they both have, they have a 50% chance of being correct. In Pauline’s case this would not really matter as there would not be any ancestors, but at least she would be able to recognise them in her site albeit with no Gender Name. As for”Ginger” He/She (As we do not know and have not been corrected) so assume that “Ginger” is a he. He will soon be corrected by relatives if he is incorrect, and just a small usage of Names in “GOOGLE” should help him... When thinking of these requests, they should be subject to Is it needed by all YES/ NO? Is the facility or similar already there to do this YES/NO Is it simple to do YES/NO? Will it be constantly in use? As other parts of the Program YES/ NO Just my thoughts Lis
Hi Pauline, used my Dad's site, before, but I meant to say DESCENDANTS not Ancestors

***************

In Pauline’s case this would not really matter as there would not be any ancestors,

Have a nice day

Lisa

G
Ginger
Hi Ginger, Family ties do not seem to be very close to you. Surely when you see these unusual names, the Family have mentioned that they have had a Son or Daughter . Otherwise when you get this info more ...
rmation, why not show some interset and ask them. My opinion is that these names are so few, that there is no point added a new box, otherwise there will be request for boxes for pets, as I know my dog "Pip" to my wife and Myself, is treated and would be missed as a Family member, and more so in some cases, as my other Dogs in the past have been. As I have mentioned, there is plenty of ways to put under the name, ( by the Member ) an explanation. By the time these Forum entries were entered it could have been done. All the best Le
Les, sorry I upset you. I understand your viewpoint if you are one of the TribalPages computer software writers. However, I do care about family!!! I have 4 ongoing websites with TribalPages and am also the reunion coordinator for either the local or the national family reunions for these trees.

I was just saying that there are times when I run across a name (i.e. Terry, Robin, Shirly, Marion) that leaves me guessing to the sex because I can not find additional info such as a middle name or a relative to clarify. Or as Pauline described with an "unknown", we can't add them to the tree because we first have to pick a "sex" box before entering name. And we can't do that if the descendants never knew there were other children in the family.

Just wanted to make my trees more accurate.

Ginger

L
Les
  website
Les, sorry I upset you. I understand your viewpoint if you are one of the TribalPages computer software writers. However, I do care about family!!! I have 4 ongoing websites with TribalPages and am more ...
also the reunion coordinator for either the local or the national family reunions for these trees. I was just saying that there are times when I run across a name (i.e. Terry, Robin, Shirly, Marion) that leaves me guessing to the sex because I can not find additional info such as a middle name or a relative to clarify. Or as Pauline described with an "unknown", we can't add them to the tree because we first have to pick a "sex" box before entering name. And we can't do that if the descendants never knew there were other children in the family. Just wanted to make my trees more accurate. Ginge
Hi Ginger and Pauline , just an ordinary member, such as yourself, and honestly not upset.

Pauline see SCREEN SHOT and for both of you this EVENT or similar can be used Over and Over, It is not a one off

I just cannot understand ,that some members, want the program altered to suit their individual needs,that may not suit others, when they can use a workaround.

As most Trees are only seen by close family, and not as some members believe by everyone, just because it is on the Web.

There is no differance, that I can see, by selecting FEMALE for TERRY although it is usually put as TERRI, and put explain underneath that this personcan be either sex. Using UNKNOWN , has to have an explanation in the same vein.

Take my name LESLIE is MALE as LESLEY is FEMALE, and yet I see that it is reversed many many times. As long as the explanation is used if needed, what difference does it make.

As you say "there are times" It is not that it is a constant thing that you see on a daily basis, whenever you do your tree, By using EVENTS as I have explained, you have your site as you wish, and all other sites are not altered

Regards

Les

PY
Pauline Young
Hi Ginger and Pauline , just an ordinary member, such as yourself, and honestly not upset. Pauline see SCREEN SHOT and for both of you this EVENT or similar can be used Over and Over, It is not a one more ...
off I just cannot understand ,that some members, want the program altered to suit their individual needs,that may not suit others, when they can use a workaround. As most Trees are only seen by close family, and not as some members believe by everyone, just because it is on the Web. There is no differance, that I can see, by selecting FEMALE for TERRY although it is usually put as TERRI, and put explain underneath that this personcan be either sex. Using UNKNOWN , has to have an explanation in the same vein. Take my name LESLIE is MALE as LESLEY is FEMALE, and yet I see that it is reversed many many times. As long as the explanation is used if needed, what difference does it make. As you say "there are times" It is not that it is a constant thing that you see on a daily basis, whenever you do your tree, By using EVENTS as I have explained, you have your site as you wish, and all other sites are not altered Regards Le
Hi Les

As you know, I've had several sites on TP for some years now, and I've used a fair number of work arounds in that time, even suggested a few to other people.

The thing is, under the heading for this section us the wording

'Would you like to see a new feature or an enhancement to an existing one?'

TP asks for suggestions, and all Ginger and I are doing is to make a suggestion, we'e not asking for the program to be re-written, just putting forward an idea. As a matter of interest, some programs (Rootsmagic is one),do allow for an unknown sex- I wonder how that would be dealt with in a gedcom upload.

We don't all have to agree on everything or the way to do things, shall we leave it at that?

Regards

Pauline

L
Les
  website
Hi Les As you know, I've had several sites on TP for some years now, and I've used a fair number of work arounds in that time, even suggested a few to other people. The thing is, under the more ...
heading for this section us the wording 'Would you like to see a new feature or an enhancement to an existing one?' TP asks for suggestions, and all Ginger and I are doing is to make a suggestion, we'e not asking for the program to be re-written, just putting forward an idea. As a matter of interest, some programs (Rootsmagic is one),do allow for an unknown sex- I wonder how that would be dealt with in a gedcom upload. We don't all have to agree on everything or the way to do things, shall we leave it at that? Regards Paulin
Hi Pauline as I said earlier

Just my opinion, and we can easily set our Tribal Page to suit ourselves, without having a program altered.

This was initialy to Ginger, as his seemed to be immediate, and as you know it takes such a long time for Tribal Pages to answer and to modify, if they deem it neccessary, so this would do as he required, and also if he looked at some of the spellings, they are obviously in the gender meant to be.

You are both asking for a box to tick, so what is the difference to making your own by using EVENTS, and naming it as you wish. After all it is simply only a box that you require to LINK to your entry.

Honestly cannot see the big issue. Yes let us just leave it at that

Regards

Les

G
Ginger
Hi Les As you know, I've had several sites on TP for some years now, and I've used a fair number of work arounds in that time, even suggested a few to other people. The thing is, under the more ...
heading for this section us the wording 'Would you like to see a new feature or an enhancement to an existing one?' TP asks for suggestions, and all Ginger and I are doing is to make a suggestion, we'e not asking for the program to be re-written, just putting forward an idea. As a matter of interest, some programs (Rootsmagic is one),do allow for an unknown sex- I wonder how that would be dealt with in a gedcom upload. We don't all have to agree on everything or the way to do things, shall we leave it at that? Regards Paulin
Thank you Pauline for sharing why we were adding comments in the section we did. Wishing you continued success in your research for ancestors and descendants on all your trees.

Ginger

L
Les
Thank you Pauline for sharing why we were adding comments in the section we did. Wishing you continued success in your research for ancestors and descendants on all your trees. Ginger
Hi Both, as you have listened to me regarding my suggestio,and any Link Box will sendyou to thesameplace. Namely the persons EDIT.

Will it help ifyou can Put a Name in a box prior to you doingthe above.

It still is in EVENTS but you can enter this in a BOX beforehand

Go to DASHBOARD

Maintenance

Change Site Title

Change Main Person

Selectr either of these andyou will see

**********************

Custom Events

In addition to the predefined events like Birth, Death, Occupation, Census etc, you can define your own custom events. Please enter the Names of your custom events.

SEE SCREEN SHOT.

Thismay give you what you want, but as I mentioned, no matter what Link Is used , you must end up with the PERSONS EDIT

All the best

Les

SN
Seshadri Nadadhur
Hi,

If the Sex/Gender is entered wrongly or changed, how to modify/correct it ?

In the Edit "Name", I don't find an option to change the gender. Only way is to delete and add the Name and ALL descendants ? Thats a whole lot of work.

Thanks

Seshadri

L
Les
  website
Hi, If the Sex/Gender is entered wrongly or changed, how to modify/correct it ? In the Edit "Name", I don't find an option to change the gender. Only way is to delete and add the Name and more ...
ALL descendants ? Thats a whole lot of work. Thanks Seshadr
Hi Seshadri , if you Delete a person that is all that you do. It does not alter anything else. You just then add the Name either as a NEW person or find it on the list, . You are asked this when you ADD.

Try it on one Name that you know you can CORRECT without losing any information

all the best

Les

SN
Seshadri Nadadhur
  website
Hi Seshadri , if you Delete a person that is all that you do. It does not alter anything else. You just then add the Name either as a NEW person or find it on the list, . You are asked this when you ADD. more ...
Try it on one Name that you know you can CORRECT without losing any information all the best Le
HI Les,

Thanks for the quick response.

Before I try this, let me further clarify.

I need to delete this name Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female) and add a new name/Son for Ravi as Bharath Ravi (Male) ? Then what about his marriage with Ramya, the date, place ... all the data that is currently linked ?

Thanks

Seshadri

L
Les
  website
HI Les, Thanks for the quick response. Before I try this, let me further clarify. I need to delete this name Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female) and add a new name/Son for Ravi as Bharath Ravi (Male) more ...
? Then what about his marriage with Ramya, the date, place ... all the data that is currently linked ? Thanks Seshadr
Hi Seshadri

First DO NOT DELETE

Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female)

but ADD

Son for Ravi as Bharath Ravi (Male

Now when you have done this ADD a SPOUSE to

Bharath Ravi .

As she is already in your TREE you will find her under

If this person already exists on this site click here

Now select her and ADD as his spouse.

You should now find that your TREE is correct.

If this is so,

Now DELETE

Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female)

Regards

Les

Please let me know how yu get on

SN
Seshadri Nadadhur
  website
Hi Seshadri First DO NOT DELETE Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female) but ADD Son for Ravi as Bharath Ravi (Male Now when you have done this ADD a SPOUSE to Bharath Ravi . As she is already in your more ...
TREE you will find her under If this person already exists on this site click here Now select her and ADD as his spouse. You should now find that your TREE is correct. If this is so, Now DELETE Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female) Regards Les Please let me know how yu get o
Hi Les,

Thanks, but it didn't work. Now details:

Without deleting, I added Bharath Ravi (Son/Male).

Wanted to add already existing Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath as spouse for this new name from the drop down list, but it didn't show up. I initially thought since she is already married, its not getting listed. Then, for Bharath (Female) & Ranjitha, I changed the status to "Not Maried", it became 'p'. Looks like TP treats unmarried Spouse as 'p'artner. Then I changed the status to Divorced, still no luck. On closer look, I realised that for the newly added Bharath Ravi (Son/Male), many female names, including married ones are getting listed for adding as spouse, but not Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath.

That made me understand TP logic: since I initially created Bharath Ravi as Female/Daughter and added spouse Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath, TP has automatically fixed gender of Ranjitha as Male. To cross check, I tried to add an existing person as Spouse for Ranjitha, all Female names, including married ones got listed.

So finally, I deleted both Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath (Male per hidden TP logic) and Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female). Added a non-existing spouse for Bharath Ravi (Son/Male) as Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath and other marriage details and notes.

In effect I had to redo the whole thing. Thank God there is no big Descendants tree for the initial Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female), otherwise I may had to delete and add all the ones. Unless there is a way to 'delink' a portion of the tree, make it 'hanging'/orphan. And 're-link' such a hanging tree to some point in an existing tree. In Unix language, 'ln' or in Win, drag and drop an item ( file or directory).

I also read the 'interesting' exchanges in "Same sex couples" thread.

As I understand, TP logics:

1. Once a person is entered as Son ( or Daughter), his/her spouse will automatically be tagged as Female ( Or Male), if the name is newly added.

2. For existing names, Male can marry only Female ( and vv).

3. It is not possible to change the Gender of a person.

4. No restriction on married people re-marrying any no of times, but with opposite gender only.

Combining it, here are my points for TP's consideration.

1. Apart from Son & Daughter, provide a 3rd option - Other or Unknown

2. More important, option to Modify the Gender of any person from one to another, without Adding / Deleting the names. The reason for this change could be due to entry mistake ( my case) OR Gender change.

3. No restriction on Others marriage - can marry Male, Female or Other. This, combined with above points, can take care of LG marriages.

Of course, TP has to make lots of coding changes, but my 2c.

Regards

Seshadri

L
Les
  website
Hi Les, Thanks, but it didn't work. Now details: Without deleting, I added Bharath Ravi (Son/Male). Wanted to add already existing Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath as spouse for this new name from the more ...
drop down list, but it didn't show up. I initially thought since she is already married, its not getting listed. Then, for Bharath (Female) & Ranjitha, I changed the status to "Not Maried", it became 'p'. Looks like TP treats unmarried Spouse as 'p'artner. Then I changed the status to Divorced, still no luck. On closer look, I realised that for the newly added Bharath Ravi (Son/Male), many female names, including married ones are getting listed for adding as spouse, but not Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath. That made me understand TP logic: since I initially created Bharath Ravi as Female/Daughter and added spouse Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath, TP has automatically fixed gender of Ranjitha as Male. To cross check, I tried to add an existing person as Spouse for Ranjitha, all Female names, including married ones got listed. So finally, I deleted both Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath (Male per hidden TP logic) and Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female). Added a non-existing spouse for Bharath Ravi (Son/Male) as Ranjitha (Ramya) Gurunath and other marriage details and notes. In effect I had to redo the whole thing. Thank God there is no big Descendants tree for the initial Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female), otherwise I may had to delete and add all the ones. Unless there is a way to 'delink' a portion of the tree, make it 'hanging'/orphan. And 're-link' such a hanging tree to some point in an existing tree. In Unix language, 'ln' or in Win, drag and drop an item ( file or directory). I also read the 'interesting' exchanges in "Same sex couples" thread. As I understand, TP logics: 1. Once a person is entered as Son ( or Daughter), his/her spouse will automatically be tagged as Female ( Or Male), if the name is newly added. 2. For existing names, Male can marry only Female ( and vv). 3. It is not possible to change the Gender of a person. 4. No restriction on married people re-marrying any no of times, but with opposite gender only. Combining it, here are my points for TP's consideration. 1. Apart from Son & Daughter, provide a 3rd option - Other or Unknown 2. More important, option to Modify the Gender of any person from one to another, without Adding / Deleting the names. The reason for this change could be due to entry mistake ( my case) OR Gender change. 3. No restriction on Others marriage - can marry Male, Female or Other. This, combined with above points, can take care of LG marriages. Of course, TP has to make lots of coding changes, but my 2c. Regards Seshadr
Hi Seshadri,

I did suggest the following

Hi Seshadri

First DO NOT DELETE

Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female)

but ADD

Son for Ravi as Bharath Ravi (Male

Now when you have done this ADD a SPOUSE to

Bharath Ravi .

As she is already in your TREE you will find her under

If this person already exists on this site click here

Now select her and ADD as his spouse.

You should now find that your TREE is correct.

***********************

As you had her Married Name and down as MALE. Did you not look under her UNMARRIED SURNAME and then she would show up to be added as SPOUSE, if you had already added her to your TREE earlier.

Then the names would have just followed correctly

Am I correct in this.

All the best

Les

SN
Seshadri Nadadhur
  website
Hi Seshadri, I did suggest the following Hi Seshadri First DO NOT DELETE Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female) but ADD Son for Ravi as Bharath Ravi (Male Now when you have done this ADD a SPOUSE to Bharath more ...
Ravi . As she is already in your TREE you will find her under If this person already exists on this site click here Now select her and ADD as his spouse. You should now find that your TREE is correct. *********************** As you had her Married Name and down as MALE. Did you not look under her UNMARRIED SURNAME and then she would show up to be added as SPOUSE, if you had already added her to your TREE earlier. Then the names would have just followed correctly Am I correct in this. All the best Le
Hi Les,

Please take time to read my detailed response.

I did follow exactly what you suggested:

Without deleting, I added Bharath Ravi (Son/Male). .....

....

All my tree's family Female names carry their original unmarried maiden surnames. "For daughter, the maiden surname/initial is maintained. If the surname/father's name is not known, I have left it as "Unknown""

Even though her name was in the tree, I was not able to add her as a spouse to a Male, since TP has tagged her as he.

Your suggestion would have worked, if I had correctly created her as a daughter of an existing person.

And a new question based on "Did you not look under her UNMARRIED SURNAME".

When a female gets married and decides to change her surname, do you keep both her original name and new name ?

eg: Eve Orange(F) marries Adam Apple (M), do you simply edit Eve Orange and make it Eve Apple or add a new spouse for Adam Apple as Eve Apple ? If later, its data duplication, same Eve but with two surnames.

Regards

Seshadri

L
Les
Hi Les, Please take time to read my detailed response. I did follow exactly what you suggested: Without deleting, I added Bharath Ravi (Son/Male). ..... .... All my tree's family Female names more ...
carry their original unmarried maiden surnames. "For daughter, the maiden surname/initial is maintained. If the surname/father's name is not known, I have left it as "Unknown"" Even though her name was in the tree, I was not able to add her as a spouse to a Male, since TP has tagged her as he. Your suggestion would have worked, if I had correctly created her as a daughter of an existing person. And a new question based on "Did you not look under her UNMARRIED SURNAME". When a female gets married and decides to change her surname, do you keep both her original name and new name ? eg: Eve Orange(F) marries Adam Apple (M), do you simply edit Eve Orange and make it Eve Apple or add a new spouse for Adam Apple as Eve Apple ? If later, its data duplication, same Eve but with two surnames. Regards Seshadr
Hi Seshadri

*****************

Your ENNTRY

Your suggestion would have worked, if I had correctly created her as a daughter of an existing person.

*****************

I assumed that you had done this, as then you would have found her under the LIST. This then would have allowed you to put her as the SPOUSE of the NEWLY entered

****

Bharath Ravi (Son/Male).

******

You could have then deleted as I mentioned

ALL FEMALES SHOULD BE ENTERED UNDER THEIR MAIDEN NAME

and only the once.

NEVER UNDER THEIR MARRIED NAME

Regards

Les

SN
Seshadri Nadadhur
  website
Hi Seshadri ***************** Your ENNTRY Your suggestion would have worked, if I had correctly created her as a daughter of an existing person. ***************** I assumed that you had done this, more ...
as then you would have found her under the LIST. This then would have allowed you to put her as the SPOUSE of the NEWLY entered **** Bharath Ravi (Son/Male). ****** You could have then deleted as I mentioned ALL FEMALES SHOULD BE ENTERED UNDER THEIR MAIDEN NAME and only the once. NEVER UNDER THEIR MARRIED NAME Regards Le
Hi Les,

I started from my known ancestor ( 3 levels up, great grand father) and built the tree down, so GGF is the 'root'. For his children, I added a spouse, but not spouse's parents. Did the same for next levels. Basically branching down and not branch up from spouse, ie not going horizontal and then going up / not tracing new family members' ancestors. I guess everyone will do the same. Of course it can be done as an extended family, but not strictly as a family. I did read a thread that someone has a tree of 50000 people, perhaps he has done that.

And in case, initially I had correctly created her as a daughter of an existing person, I would have found her under the LIST, but TP logic would not have listed her to add her as spouse for Bharath Ravi (Daughter/Female). Perhaps that would have sounded a bell and I would have noticed my mistake.

We are digressing. To my initial point of 'correcting a wrongly entered gender of a person', there is no way but to delete that person, spouse and their descendants and re-create all.

Hence my suggestion, repeating:

1. Apart from Son & Daughter, provide a 3rd option - Other or Unknown

2. More important, option to Modify the Gender of any person from one to another, without Adding / Deleting the names. The reason for this change could be due to entry mistake ( my case) OR Gender change.

3. No restriction on Others marriage - can marry Male, Female or Other. This, combined with above points, can take care of LG marriages.

Of course, TP has to make lots of coding changes, but my 2c and I stop here.

Regards

Seshadri